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I just started the game and played for about an hour before I had to reluctantly give it up to spend time with my sweetie for the evening.  Here are a few initial impressions:

   
• Vehicle: way early in the game you drive a car that is quite reminiscent of the Datsun in FC2.  You get in and all is silent until you press the throttle and then the car moves (with engine sounds).  Kind of strange that the car does not make a sound when idling.  Driving is similar to FC2 for me; as I like to say to my wife when she asks what I'm doing "I'm careening down the road"
• Loot chests: feels kind of like the treasure chests in Just Cause 2, or more like the chests in AC3 - you get some kind of trinket plus some cash
• Moving across the terrain on foot: no more did I experience the pebbles that were insurmountable!  I was able to easily walk up hillsides.  I even found a cave that reminded me of the caves in AC3 where you find loot.
• Towers: activate towers and you get weapons for free - not from a weapons dealer, but from a general store.  The first tower I encountered felt like the tower in the junk yard in FC2.  However it was much higher, and much better eye candy.  Once you activate the tower at the top (kind of like activating the cell tower missions in FC2) you can zip line down to the ground - felt like zip lining in AC:Revelations.  Also, activating towers appears to reveal additional parts of the map, which is also like synchronizing in the AC series.
• Hunting and collecting: hunting reminds me of Red Dead Redemption, and AC3.  You kill and skin animals.  You also collect plants which is exactly like you did in RDR.
• Sound effects:  your character actually speaks to himself rather than being completely soundless. Some of the sounds remind me of FC2.
• Shacks and other buildings: my beloved tin-roofed shacks from FC2 are there as are the austere light poles!  I love the buildings.
• In game map: is much like the AC maps - you open it and can set way points.  You also have fast travel icons which you can activate and you are immediately transported to that location.
• Swimming: is fantastic.  One of the tutorial missions included collecting plants, and one of those was a plant at the bottom of a river.  You jump in and then swim down - lots of eye candy.
• Landscape: at first I thought there was no way I would like the jungle as much as I love the African environment, but I am beginning to change my mind.  The view from the top of the tower was simply spectacular!
• HUD: I really don't like the HUD too much, but it is not that bad - am accustomed to similar in the AC games.
• Stealth: so far so good - you are able to hide in grass just like in AC3.  You can throw rocks to distract guards which is similar to throwing things in the AC series.

So far, the game starts somewhat like FC2 except you don't have a town break-out like what you needed to do in Pala.  Instead, you activate a tower (there are many more), and then you do a hunting and collecting expedition.  I'm sure there is much more to come.
It looks like the developers have taken elements out of several other games, and have listened to the complaints about FC2 in the creation of this game.  To sum it up, there are enough similarities between FC2 and FC3 to have me really excited to play the game.  As many of you already know, if not for FC2, I'd not be gaming.

I don't want to jinx it, but if the rest of the game is anything like the beginning, I'm going to spend many, many hours in the jungle, just like with FC2  >:D

All sounding good :-X

I like the idea of throwing rocks to distract guards. You used to be able to do that in FC1 and it was one of things I was sorry they didn't carry over into FC2. Glad to hear that's back in :-X

I could copy + paste your first impressions into a post of my own, PZ... it sure delivers a great Far Cry experience... Oh yeah!  :-X

Just like you I only had time to play an hour or so yesterday... just the tutorial missions down to the point where you reveal part of the map and collect plants and hunt boars, but I can feel I'm playing an upgraded  Far Cry game!!

I also enjoyed the fact that you are "introduced" to some game aspects by Dennis, in the village, and he is from Nigeria (according to his game profile) which brings some of the African accent into this new game... feels like a smooth transition of environments!  :-X

A few elements are sure brought back from FC2, as you said... shacks, antennas and poles but also some foliage. Sounds like picking up ammo are the same.

As I'm playing in the PC I have DX11 running and boy does it look great!!!!!  8)

I don't want to jinx it, but if the rest of the game is anything like the beginning, I'm going to spend many, many hours in the jungle, just like with FC2  >:D
Hello old friend PZ :) I have the game already passed. and started again))))) The final game has disappointed, but it's still a great game! World truly alive! Nature is amazing! Fly like a bird on a hang glider fantastic! Enemies are smart and really dangerous! Now, more adrenaline in the blood! Now I'm a real hunter for a skulls)))) I think this game is destined to live long.
I hope that real life will not harmed ;)

Now the pack is back to play the same game the predecessor of which initially united all of us  :) :-X

Quote from: Art Blade on December 05, 2012, 07:45:37 AM
Now the pack is back to play the same game the predecessor of which initially united all of us  :) :-X

... and the prophecy is fullfiled!!!  8)

Quote from: Art Blade on December 05, 2012, 07:45:37 AM
Now the pack is back to play the same game the predecessor of which initially united all of us  :) :-X

Yes, indeed!  :-X :P

Quote from: shelmez on December 05, 2012, 06:45:16 AM
... I have the game already passed. and started again)))))

Wow, you've already completed the game!  :-X  I think you're correct; the game will please for a long time.

Quote from: JRD on December 05, 2012, 04:10:59 AM
I also enjoyed the fact that you are "introduced" to some game aspects by Dennis, in the village, and he is from Nigeria (according to his game profile) which brings some of the African accent into this new game... feels like a smooth transition of environments!  :-X

So true!  Hearing his accent brought back fond memories of what I loved about FC2  ^-^

I played for about an hour this morning and boy did the time go by fast; this is the first time in a while that a game has excited me this much and I'm only at the beginning.  Here are a few more observations:

   
• Drive a technical this morning, and the engine sounds are just fine.  I'm not sure why the Datsun didn't make engine noise; probably just a fluke.  You can repair vehicles like in FC2, only this time you need to purchase a $400 tool (welding torch) from the shop.  I also found an ATV and it drives well - fast and nimble.
• Evidently your fast travel points serve as safe houses of sorts, and you need to discover them like in FC2.  However, you can purchase items in these houses, and change weapons much like the armory in FC2, but you don't see the equipment on the wall; you choose it from a menu.
• Because I had activated a tower, I received a free 6P9!  What is cool is that I went into the shop and purchased a silencer and some kind of night vision accessory (you can add up to two accessories at a time).  The developers heard the gamers designing the game with weapons that you can change
• I'm at the point where I need to talk to some Dr., but he is across the map a ways, so I'm traveling the roads - ran into mercs - three technicals descended on me.  I have only a single weapon slot available so all I had was the silenced 6P9.  However, now that weapon has reasonable strength - I could actually kill them and not expend a clip per man!
• You can pick up the dead mercs weapon, but you can also loot their dead bodies like in the AC series.
• As part of the tutorial, I crafted a backpack out of some skins and now I can carry lots of things (32 items at a time).  You can open the backpack in the store and sell things, or use items to craft things like syrettes.  The game also gives you recommendations as to whether or not to keep an item for crafting, or to sell it for cash.
• I like the syrette mechanism - you now hunt for medicinal plants and can then craft the medicine, or if you don't want to do that, you can purchase the syrettes from the shop.
• Movement is really smooth, and it is easy to target the mercs; I'm not sure how they did it, but the movement mechanics are better than they were in FC2.
• The environment is really beautiful; I ran into an area that reminded me of another game, Just Cause 2.  In fact, the Island environment reminds me of Panau
• There are people in the village that I have entered - they are milling about like the people in JC2
• I ran into a rabid dog, and intended to use my knife, but a villager not far behind me started firing at the dog, which aided me in killing it - that's cool; you have friends that will help you.

All in all, the game is more impressive each time I open it, and I've only played for about 2 hours now.  :-X

nice observations there, PZ :) You can't walk for a minute without running into this or that distraction.. kind of hard to focus. You see a living environment with everything in it but children  :-D It sure is a game that you can lose yourself in and come back to for a long time. :-X

One thing I forgot to mention; I was still doing one of the early missions when I heard a voice on the radio - I could swear that was Prosper Kouassi.  You might remember the first mission you get when you enter the southern map in FC2 - go back north and kill either Gakumba or Kouassi whichever mission you had triggered.

If you've forgotten, he was the guy standing atop a rail car with a megaphone, and part of his speech was "You are men! .... powerful men!"

We might hear a few other voices we know  ;)

On a different note, when you get into a vehicle, the radio automatically plays, which is initially kind of fun, but might prove to be distracting after a while.  I wonder if there is a way to turn it off.

There is. You can even switch stations.  :)

just checked: you need to check your controller layout in a vehicle -- on my PC it's C to switch it off and N to change stations.

That is really cool  :-X

I sure do hope gibbed is planning on making modding tools.  I recall modding the radio in Fallout3 adding my own sound tracks to the stations.  That was lots of fun and resulted in a more immersive experience for me because I added old time radio commercials instead of all music.

UPDATE: just received an email from gibbed indicating that he is already working on the FC3 tools.   :-X

I'd better get a copy of FC3 for my PC and get ready for the fun  >:D

Hello fellow FC3 fans,
Here are some of my first impressions after playing about 5 hours.

As a big fan of FC2, I was very excited for this game, and so far it's not disappointed me. It's beautiful, the large island feels alive with tons of animals (there are 31 different species are in the game.) We can carry up to 4 weapons (compared to 3 in FC2) and we're able to customize them using the automated machine at safehouses but it's a shame that we can't customize weaposn on the fly. The stealth is good, greatly improved from FC2. I often do not like stealth games but I really enjoy sneaking up on the pirates and stealth kill them. The takedown are very satisfying :) The faction wars between humans or animals and humans are a nice improvement.  I've just have a memorable experience. While I was wandering in the buffalo hide to skin them for making ammo pouch, 2 pirates spotted me and they started firing at me. But suddenly 2 cassowaries ran to them and attacked them to death! I thanked them for saving my precious bullet which are expensive in this game. The cassowaries in this game are suprsingly  agressive and dangerous. They attack you without any provocation and they often attack in group. I was attacked and died once when I was skinning the buffaloes, so be careful.

The cover mechanic is one of the best in games.

But it's worse to FC2 in a few aspect, like:

- Unlike FC2, this game has only 1 save slot. This is annoying because I want to load a save file to play after finishing the game.

- Is it just me or the vehicle handling is worse than FC2 ?
- Daynight cycle is faster than FC2.

- We can't set clock at safehouses. Another great feature of FC2 that I really miss because if I want to do a stealth mission at night, I can't set the clock at night. What a shame.

- Although I like the tropical island setting, it's  really gorgeous but like PZ, I still prefer Africa as it's more diverse in terrains as well as clolors (savannah, desert, jungle, mountain ...). Here, all you see is green and jungle, mountain and beach.

- Fire propagation. it still spreads dynamically here but because it's a wet environment, the fire is not as spectacular as its was in Africa, especially at night.

- The mercs, IMO are somewhat funner than the pirates
- I wish I can turn off the radio in the cars.

Nice first post durian, and I agree with all of them (that I have experienced so far only 2 hours into the game).

I didn't realize you can't set a clock for napping in the safe houses; that will be sorely missed because like you I often went out at night particularly on difficult missions.  I suppose the lack of manipulating the day/night cycle is the reason for the short cycle duration.

That's too bad about the fire, but reasonable considering the wet environment.  I was kind of hoping that there would at least be a variety of environments like in FC2, where we had both desert and jungle.

I haven't driven the vehicles enough to notice if handling is worse, but most people seem to report it being so.  Art also reported that it is far easier to damage the vehicles now as well.  There is also a new way of repairing them - you need to purchase a welding torch.  I wonder if the repair animations are more realistic than in FC2 where all you did was turn a wrench on the radiator.  :-()

Can't wait to get back into the game  ^-^

PS: welcome to OWG!

Quote from: PZ on December 06, 2012, 02:28:21 PM
I didn't realize you can't set a clock for napping in the safe houses; that will be sorely missed because like you I often went out at night particularly on difficult missions.  I suppose the lack of manipulating the day/night cycle is the reason for the short cycle duration.


I haven't driven the vehicles enough to notice if handling is worse, but most people seem to report it being so.  Art also reported that it is far easier to damage the vehicles now as well.  There is also a new way of repairing them - you need to purchase a welding torch.  I wonder if the repair animations are more realistic than in FC2 where all you did was turn a wrench on the radiator.  :-()

Can't wait to get back into the game  ^-^

PS: welcome to OWG!

Thanks PZ
I was infitrating an outpost at night and after a while, before I completed the mission, it's morning. I don't like that.
Some people complained FC2 vehicle handling was bad I think it's good and better than FC3. The cars in FC3 feel like they have little weight so it's very easy to lose control of the cars and crash into objects ...

Quote from: durian on December 06, 2012, 02:47:08 PM
The cars in FC3 feel like they have little weight so it's very easy to lost control of the cars and crash into objects ...

True... I'm only 1 hour into the game (real life is quite demanding sometimes... you know  ::) and only drove the car in the tutorial, but weightless is a good definition of what it feels like! As for handling, I think in FC2 all vehicles felt too stiff but in FC3 they feel more loose as if the rear was sliding over mud and the controls went a bit off the track... but I like the way cars handle so far!!

The problem I'm having with the vehicles is more about braking - I stomp the hand brake and the vehicle feels like the brakes are not so effective.  I probably just need to get more practice because I'm still driving FC2-style

^^
Oh yes, I forgot about this issue. The hand brake is not very effective.

Another thing I miss is the vegetation interaction in FC2.
The music in FC3 IMO is better.

I now regret some mistakes I made in this game.

- Buying weapons. You don't have to send your hard eaned cash to buy the guns as they become free after you activing the radio towers.
- Buying ammo. It's expensive and a waste of money. In the beginning you can carry a very limited amount of ammo so you may run out of it fast. Just go hunting, skin animals to make bigger ammo pouches so that the problem will be solved.

Quote from: durian on December 06, 2012, 03:16:27 PM
- Buying weapons. You don't have to send your hard eaned cash to buy the guns as they become free after you activing the radio towers.
- Buying ammo. It's expensive and a waste of money. In the beginning you can carry a very limited amount of ammo so you may run out of it fast. Just go hunting, skin animals to make bigger ammo pouches so that the problem will be solved.

These are good tips; I noticed that after activating my first tower, a free 6P9 and some kind of assault rifle were available in the vending machine store.

I forgot all about the skins and creating ammo pouches.  In fact, because crafting was not a part of FC2 and I'm so accustomed to doing things the FC2 way it has been difficult for me to remember to do the crafting of those very useful items.  Things like ammo pouches, and health syrettes.  Collecting the raw materials and hunting for the animal skins is kind of fun anyway, and somewhat follows the same kind of crafting as in Assassin's creed 3

I've just read your first impressions on AC3, you said we could sneak up behind a deer and killed it with the knife. This makes me think why Jason can't stealth kill animals in this game ?
That would me killing the dangerous predators like tiger, leopard, komodo dragon ... easier and satisfying.

That's an interesting idea;  I've not much of the stealth in vegetation in FC3 yet, but in AC3 you are virtually invisible - the opponents there typically have to step on you to notice your presence.  Same with the animals - sure would be nice if FC3 were similar.

On that note, it almost seems like there are other elements in FC3 that are similar to things in AC3 - like the HUD for example.

As I climbed into the drivers seat of the Stryus (one of the cars that looks like the Datsun in FC2) I took a look at the journal entry for that vehicle.  Reading these descriptive entries is kind of funny.  In this one you discover that the Stryus was made in South Africa, and that lots of these kinds of vehicles end up on the island.  The good part is that when the engine dies, a family can simply pull out the interior and voila... they have a new house  :laugh:

 :-D

First, let me say hi durian and welcome to OWG :)

I too pretty much agree with your impressions of the game thus far.

Re: stealth killing animals, this is a way to do it apparently (I haven't tried it myself): there's a particular kind of syringe you can craft that when used gives you the ability to go after animals that are normally spooked by you, such as goats. The downside is that when you use the syringe it only lasts for, I think, 20 seconds, although I think there's a skill that can extend that time.

I haven't really formed a opinion about vehicles yet, possibly because I haven't done much driving at this stage, although I really like the jet ski 8) Jumping out of a moving car is certainly different to FC2, as your guy doesn't just jump out and immediately stand still, he actually tumbles along on the ground, as you would if you jumped out of a moving car. I kind of like that, it's a bit more realistic.

I piloted a jet sky outside of Denis' town and went down a series of falls - the 3D nature of the water ways is much more realistic  :-X

From my end, too: Hi and welcome to OWG, durian :)

I've never had any serious issues with any of those vehicles, neither in FC2 nor in FC3. All I wanted in FC2 was more speed, and speed I've got in FC3. Damn, you can really bomb down a dusty road and smash into living obstacles which usually results in a satisfying gush of blood, screaming and well, not really satisfying but still OK, breaking parts of your vehicle up to a full stop with smoking engine.  :-D

Stealth hunting: I use different syringes for hunting. The one described by fragger ("hunter's instinct") which makes me see silhouettes of animals even through rocks (and yes, mine do last longer, 1.5 minutes) as well as a repellent syringe that prevent any animals that are not aquatic from attacking you. But there is a simpler solution: use silenced weapons (i.e. the Assault rifle MS-16 or a silenced sniper M-700 or.. the massive bow and regular arrows) :-D

In playing the Assassin's Creed series, I've accumulated lots of Uplay credits, which I can use in FC3 purchases.  I obtained the large pistol last night, but have not used it because I had to go offline right away.  Two questions:

1. Do you equip it in the vending machine or store?
2. Can you equip it with a silencer?

I absolutely love this game!

Just started using the camera extensively because it is quite useful to tag targets.  It is remiscent of a SOFLAM that I have used in Medal of Honor

I've been clearing guard posts to create more fast travel locations.  These are loads of fun; In the first one I shot at a cage with a tiger within and it escaped killing many of the pirates.  To add icing to the cake, I was able to take it's hid after clearing the area!

On an aside, some people in the Ubi forums have been complaining that the "killed animals disappear almost before you can skin them".  I've not experienced this at all, and am thinking that much like in FC2, if you wander too far from the area, you will lose items.  However, this distance seems to be quite far if my tiger experience is any measure; I was running and gunning to get the area cleared and still the tiger carcass remained.

They mean that you shoot an animal from some distance and when you arrive at the place where it should be, you can't find it. Particularly in grassy areas, the dead bodies tend to just disappear. Under normal circumstances, the animals won't disappear, so I consider it a glitch which I too have experienced more than once.

The .44 Magnum hand cannon is one of a couple of so called signature weapons that are customised weapons with usually supreme qualities (can't get that result if you customise the base weapon on your own). So you can't change anything and have to take (or leave) it as is.

You can customise almost all weapons that are not signature weapons; check the stats of the weapon you may wish to acquire -- on the top right of the stats badge is a hint as to how many customisations may be bought and added if any at all. For example, some guns can have extended magazines, various types of visors and sometimes suppressors/silencers yet only one or two of those at the time. You can have a silencer and a scope but not an additional extended magazine. You can, however, attach and detach extensions that you already possess.

Any weapon you wish to equip must be equipped in the menu of either one of the few real arms dealers or one of the plenty vending machines. Only exception: weapons dropped by enemies can be picked up (they replace the one currently in your hands) and be used right away. Well, there are Hunter's Path missions that will provide a weapon which can be picked up on site (but if you have an equivalent you may as well use your own).

:)

 :-X

I bought the .44 on Uplay yesterday, but I've not found it - where do you get it in the game?

way down the weapons list at a vending machine or arms dealer, "signature weapons"  :) You'll still have to buy and equip it.

You have to buy it... twice?  I already purchased it from Uplay!   ????

Thanks for the info AB!  :-X

I think I'll purchase a sniper first.  I already have an assault rifle (AK-47), a silent 6P9, and a silenced submachine gun, all of which keep me occupied nicely  :-()

On a side note, I liked the sound of the AK-47 in FC2 better than the one in FC3

you used your U-Play tokens to make the weapon available in FC3. There you need to buy it with FC3 dollahs   :-D Which indeed is silly. Oh, and, welcome  ^-^

Each radio tower you disable makes a weapon become free, but at this stage I can't tell if there's any correlation between particular towers and weapons. There probably isn't, it's more likely based on how many towers you've done so far that determines which weapon gets made free next. I did free up an SVD Dragunov from a tower but I can't remember which tower it was.

If you go through the main missions until you meet a guy named Willis, he will give you the flamethrower for free. That's wep is a blast, literally :-() It has a bit better range than the one in FC2. Just don't burn yourself with it...

I'm really liking the weapon sounds in the game :-X And I really like that recursive bow, especially for hunting. It doesn't alert any nearby bad guys, and it's just so cool 8) And you can get the arrows back after you've brought down animals, provided you can find/get to the carcasses. I too have noticed that if you go any distance from dead bodies they will disappear.

Quote from: fragger on December 07, 2012, 09:54:31 PM
... And you can get the arrows back after you've brought down animals, provided you can find/get to the carcasses.

Just like in AC3 - man, those developer groups must have been collaborating.

they got fired, hired, fired, hired.. all the way down to FC3.  :-D

Here's something new for me; I liberated one of the posts, and afterward got into a truck.  A couple of the locals jumped in the back and we went for a joy ride through the countryside killing animals and pirates.

I'd never had the friendlies jump into my ride before  :-X

Reminds me of modding JC2 where the factions ride with you and attack whomever you are attacking.

Just did an outpost a short while ago which was fun and reminiscent of the sniper hide fragger found in the Polytechnic in FC2.  I perched high on a mountain and used the camera to tag everyone.  Although I could hear a large cat, which was in a cage, I could not see it, hence was not able to release it to dispatch the pirates.

FC23 is so much more realistic than FC2 when it comes to merc behavior - they can see you, but if you hide and more, you can easily lose them.

Just had another great episode with an outpost.  Was approaching when I heard a deep throaty growl - turned out to be a tiger behind me.  I ran straight through the outpost surprising the pirates, and as I exited the other side I heard the screams of mauled pirates and lots of gunfire  :-()

Quote from: PZ on December 08, 2012, 03:49:05 PM
Just had another great episode with an outpost.  Was approaching when I heard a deep throaty growl - turned out to be a tiger behind me.  I ran straight through the outpost surprising the pirates, and as I exited the other side I heard the screams of mauled pirates and lots of gunfire  :-()

Funny.  :-X

Well, I ran out of towers to activate (the southwest is evidently locked out FC2 style until you complete some mission.  Because I'd done all the rest and had cleared out quite a few outposts for fast travel points, I decided to do the Doc mission, which I had been dreading after seeing the videos.  However, the mission was quite fun  :-X

Easy travel solution

The next step was the Medusa mission, which was quite a distance away, but there was an easy solution - the hang glider!  The developers have done a great job with the FC3 hang gliders.  I took one from Doc's mountain top and flew it toward the destination.  Rather than the short 15-second flights in FC2, this was an extended flight that allowed lots of sightseeing time.  ^-^

Here are a few more observations:

   
• Stealth works, and when you use silent weapons, they behave as you would expect: no one is alerted
• Using waterways: reminds me of Just Cause 2, and the huge world in that game.  In fact, the boat engine sounds are quite similar.  Although I've not done a huge amount of boat travel, it is pleasing that you are not attacked every 30 seconds.
• Animals: I still have not fully acclimated to all of the wildlife. The land animals are now quite familiar, but I was wading through a stream when a crocodile did me in.  :-()
• Towers: are varied in that I have not experienced two exactly the same yet.  These also remind me of Assassin's Creed observation points - you find a way to climg up, then you do an activity that reveals the detail of that area of the map.
• Mini map: also very similar to the AC series, so I'm accustomed to it.  I find that I use it quite frequently just like in AC, but I'll be looking forward to the promised patch that will allow a clean uncluttered screen.
• Weapons accessories: is simply great.  You can take your M16 and add a silencer, large magazine, red dot, or optics.  The only down side is that you are limited to the number of accessories that you can equip at any given time.
• Skills: might be the hidden gem.  For instance, I learned a skill that allows me to heal myself even without syrettes - you see the animation of wrapping your limb with bandages.
• Vehicles: It almost feels like you are driving on snow because the vehicle slides so much.  However, I am refining my driving skills, and it almost feels better than FC2 once you become accustomed to the new mechanics.
• Medicine challenges: These are almost exactly like the races in Just Cause 2 - you get into a vehicle and then you race down the road, or beach, or whatever and go through checkpoints until you reach your destination.

I just love this game.

It does hook one in :)

I haven't seen a croc yet, but I did see a vulture pecking at a dead body. I've also seen rats, land crabs and some tropical birds.

I've noticed that when you do tangle with mercs while you're out and about, they will chase you for quite a long way. They're more persistent that way than the FC2 ones were.

One of my favourite fighting skills is the double knife takedown, especially effective when you see two pirates walking along a road one behind the other as you often do. Sneak up from behind and stab the trailing guy with your knife, then immediately pull his knife out and throw it into his mate's back. Priceless! >:D

Quote from: fragger on December 08, 2012, 10:06:52 PM
One of my favourite fighting skills is the double knife takedown, especially effective when you see two pirates walking along a road one behind the other as you often do. Sneak up from behind and stab the trailing guy with your knife, then immediately pull his knife out and throw it into his mate's back. Priceless! >:D

Excellent!  :-X

On another note, the environment is so diverse that it is rather fun walking around.  I remember in FC2 that I almost always drive rather than walked because the landscape was not that interesting once you realized the pattern, but here in FC3 there are always surprises.  For instance, I was driving to a destination when I encountered what looked like one of the temples in Just Cause 2.  Naturally I stopped to investigate and found a dead man hanging as well as a few lootables.

Yep, there's certainly a wealth of things to discover. I'm finding  myself walking most places too, it's just all so cool to look at :-X

..and so fun to bite at (that's what the world around you thinks about you)  :-D

So true :-D Enjoy the walk but carry a big effing stick

never mind hand grenades, mines, C4..  :-D

Just used the Ubisoft interactive map to discover there are APCs on the island.  I gotta drive one of those  >:D

I find myself enjoying the game more each day I play.  In fact, it has been a long time since I have actually played a game during the week either before or after w@&k.  It's not the main missions that keep bringing me in, but all of the side activities you can do, and even things as simple as free roaming just to experience all of the beauty of what the islands have to offer.  :-X

This game is addtictive. I've just completed my first 2 side quests, the second one (Light in the Jungle) was funny  :-()

Yes it is; I can't believe you're already doing a second play through  :-X

Indeed.. addictive, I even dreamt the second night in a row about this game  :laugh:

I just went back to the northern island to see how it is without enemies (liberated that part of the map) and as expected, I do like it. I did some wingsuit base jumps.. oh man. Forget the hang glider  :-D

Quote from: PZ on December 12, 2012, 02:42:11 PM
Yes it is; I can't believe you're already doing a second play through  :-X

No, still 1st play thru.
But I'm planning to play through it again.

Quote from: durian on December 12, 2012, 05:17:26 PM
No, still 1st play thru.
But I'm planning to play through it again.

ah, I see... feeling that way is an indication of a good game  :-X

I'm into my second go-around, this time on Easy (Adventurer). It does make a bit of a difference.

This time I'm kitting up as much as possible before going into the story proper, and I'm going to leave ALL of the outposts in enemy hands until after the game (except for that one you have to do as part of the tutorial). It's more fun getting around that way anyhow, reminiscent of FC2 - having to be on the alert and plan my way around the outposts, and pick fights with patrolling pirates whenever I get a hankering for it.

Gonna try and get all the relics and lost letters too, to unlock a few sig weapons and just for the hell of it 8)

I love the wingsuit, if only I had that form the beginning. Mod, anyone...?

Quote from: fragger on December 13, 2012, 05:02:33 AM
I'm into my second go-around, this time on Easy (Adventurer). It does make a bit of a difference.

This time I'm kitting up as much as possible before going into the story proper, and I'm going to leave ALL of the outposts in enemy hands until after the game (except for that one you have to do as part of the tutorial). It's more fun getting around that way anyhow, reminiscent of FC2 - having to be on the alert and plan my way around the outposts, and pick fights with patrolling pirates whenever I get a hankering for it.

Gonna try and get all the relics and lost letters too, to unlock a few sig weapons and just for the hell of it 8)

I love the wingsuit, if only I had that form the beginning. Mod, anyone...?

Sounds like your experience will be quite different this time around  :-X

Last evening, I witnessed a strange incident. After I liberated an outpost (Hubert Shore on the south east of the North island), I was leaving this outpost then I heard gunshots, I saw some Rakyat warriors shooting at some one, I thought they were fighting pirates or animals but I didn't see any. Instead I saw a woman who was running screaming :"Help! Help!" I decided to help her but too late, she was killed by 5 Rakyat guys. Then I killed all of those guys.

 ????  indeed strange; Rakyat criminals.  How are they at fighting?  better/same/worse than the pirates?

I haven't yet seen all too many incidents with the Rakyat. If so, I usually was somehow involved, not to say the reason  :-()

Quote from: PZ on December 13, 2012, 01:42:39 PM
????  indeed strange; Rakyat criminals.  How are they at fighting?  better/same/worse than the pirates?

Looked like they are the same as the pirates.

At another outposts I liberated after that one, I saw a loapard in a cage. I shot the chase to free him (or her). The leopard ignored me although I was pretty close to him, instead he went on a killing spree, mauled all of 4 Rakyat guys before run to me. But I didn't want to be his 5th entrees for his dinner so I shot him  :-()

nice one. :-D

I'm always listening for a cat growl when I go into a pirate infested area, then look for the cage (with camera) so I can release the cat who then softens up the enemy a bit.  It's great fun to watch the cat at w@&k through all obstacles (because of camera tagging) - the enemy tags disappear one by one  :-()

Hehehe, yes.. I like to watch that stuff, too  :)

Recently, on a mission, I had tagged a Molotov charger who was then behind obstacles and quite far away. I shot and missed him with my assault rifle but his silhouette started to display really crazy movements and I heard him screaming when all of a sudden the red marker and silhouette disappeared. There is only one explanation: he set himself on fire and burnt himself to a crispy critter  :-()

 :laugh:  It is amazing how far those guys can run while on fire

At another outpost, I shot the cage to liberate the tiger, as you can guess, he mauled the pirates guy and I got 1500 XP. The Rakyat guys came in, but a bear suddenly showed up in the outpost and mauled all of them  ;D He nearly killed me too but I managed to stabbed and shot him

That would be a sight to see!  I love open world games that are so alive.  On this point alone FC3 is better than FC2, which felt a bit more sterile.

absolutely :)

Man, animals are always good for a shock. I remember looting a chest inside a hut without doors when I heard a "snap!" and the game made me look down while going "AAaargh!" so I could see the dragon which bit me in my foot!

Scanning a small lake with my camera, nothing got tagged so I felt secure and went in to cut some blue leaves when a crocodile jumped in my face  :o Those crocs apparently don't register with the camera, same goes for snakes and small animals like rats or crabs.

Looting a chest amongst buffaloes that didn't seem to care about me nearly cost me my life when I got headbutted and knocked down several times by one of them that I didn't see coming.. ouch!

Camera out, turning slowly to do a 360 scan, I saw fullscreen two yellow eyes in an orange face with black stripes and huge white fangs-- AAAAaaargh!!!

Homing in on an outpost, one of those predator birds came walking into view and I shot it with a shotgun. All the other birds that had been quiet and slow all of a sudden started to gawk at me and then they all ran towards me with quite some cackling and man what a slashing and slicing ensued.. I had the entire bird crew on me in no time. ??? You better kill them stealthily so the comrades won't come looking.

:)

Yep the animals often appear when I least expected.

Yesterday, I was doing a side quest (take photo of 4 barcodes at the accident scene near a river). Out of a blue, a bear attacked me. I was struggling to fend off the beast, stabbed him and then backed up to the river as I know bears can't swim. But as soon as the bear walked away, I was attacked again. This time is a croc  :o

Keeps you on your toes.  Walking away from roads in FC2 was an easy stroll in the park.

Has anyone been bitten by a snake? I'd be curious to know what happens - do you simply lose some health or does your health slowly ebb away as the poison spreads? And if so, can you stop it? Maybe I'll risk a reload and try it :-()

I too have jumped into a river to escape a tiger, only to get taken by a crocodile ??? It's definitely more of a living world than FC2's :-X

There isn't much in the way of conversation between idle bad guys though - well, none really, they generally just gripe to themselves. I did however listen to a conversation between two Rakyat guys after I'd saved their bacon against some pirates. They went on about how one of them's mother had invited the other over for dinner (he was his cousin), one asked if the other one's sister was going to be there, they talked about one of them's kid and how she was now walking and talking, then talked about doing something special for the meal... it was quite an exchange, the only one I've heard so far. But then a cassowary came along and killed one of them, along with the conversation :-()

I also came across one pirate training two others at shooting, giving them tips and stuff. But they spotted me before I could watch and listen to very much of it and started putting their training into practice. I showed them what they were doing wrong >:D

Quote from: fragger on December 13, 2012, 10:01:39 PM
I also came across one pirate training two others at shooting, giving them tips and stuff. But they spotted me before I could watch and listen to very much of it and started putting their training into practice. I showed them what they were doing wrong >:D

:laugh: :-X

I've been bitten several times, and is no different than any other animal attack.  The snake bites and an animation proceeds where you fling the snake's body away from you.  There is a slight health loss, but nothing much.

I do miss listening to the idle merc talk from FC2, but I guess something has to give to add so much more horsepower to FC3.

Quote from: fragger on December 13, 2012, 10:01:39 PMa cassowary came along and killed one of them, along with the conversation :-()

:laugh: excellent

Quote from: fragger on December 13, 2012, 10:01:39 PM
Has anyone been bitten by a snake? I'd be curious to know what happens - do you simply lose some health or does your health slowly ebb away as the poison spreads? And if so, can you stop it? Maybe I'll risk a reload and try it :-()

There isn't much in the way of conversation between idle bad guys though - well, none really, they generally just gripe to themselves.

I was bitten by snakes many times but I think I just lost a bit of my health. No poison.

I miss the banters of the bad guys in FC2.

Now that I'm on south island, I'm having a blast, but still have almost all of the side missions and most of the outposts to attack on north island.  Here's my plan:

   
• I've activated all of the towers so now have access to all of the weapons (except special).  All of the map is visible.
• I'm attacking select outposts with lots of scouting and thought.  These are so much fun!  I'm not planning to do them all, but every other one across the map so I'll always have a few roving patrols as I pass through the red areas of the map.
• Explore all the nooks and crannies of the island and practice different techniques of attack.
• I'm using gliders and the wing suit to fly, but mostly I like driving machine gun trucks MGTs.  I also like to use boats because the waterways are not as hostile as they were in FC2 (no mortar men, nor turbojet swamp boats).  Plus there is always the opportunity to run over a shark or two.  >:D

I'm really loving this form of game play, and compared to doing the same thing in FC2 is orders of magnitude better in FC3 - this is even more fun than I imagined.

I'm impressed with the towers.  I expected them to be all the same, but there is slight variation in how you ascend each.  These are quite well done, and the icing on the cake is that they reveal the map and make weapons free in the vending machine.

Spoiler

There are categories of activities like climbing ropes, jumping over open spaces, and climbing ladders, but enough variation to make each one unique.  For instance, there is one where you need to use a zip line to get to the first layer from which you can ascend.

I have to say that outside of the story, this game is absolutely bags of fun, I agree that in this respect it's better than FC2 :-X I'm having a lot more fun with it this time around, I'm glad now that I didn't ditch it completely. I admit it, I was wrong about it - outside the main story missions anyway, I'll never be crazy about those. I've already put in about 20 hours and haven't even done the first main mission yet. All the outposts are manned by bad guys and the roads are rotten with patrols. I have to be vigilant as I'm in constant danger every step of the way - and, loving it ;)

On easy mode it's a blast picking fights with roving pirates. A couple of times I've simply fired a gun in the air to get a response :-() Then it's find a good possie and start picking them off when they come looking.

Agree about the towers, getting up some of those is almost like a minigame 8) Then it's fun to try finding the special locations they show you when you interact with them.

I'm glad you didn't give it up either, fragger - glad that you're doing the free roaming, which in my opinion is the star of the game  ^-^

 :)

spot on  :)

While I love my console, it sure is more fun playing on the PC.  For instance, I did the prison break-in mission where Jason saves his girlfriend from the burning hotel.  When I did it on the console, I was livid with anger at how many times I had to re-do the timed segment.  Because the mouse controls are orders of magnitude more responsive on the PC, I was able to go through in a single try with plenty of time to spare.  That alone made this linear mission, which I originally hated, into one that I can tolerate, and even enjoy a bit because it passes quickly.

 :-X

I have to say that even though I don't like timed missions, the ones in FC3 are generally pretty easy to beat. That one where you have to get to Willis before he takes off, for example - you actually have more than enough time to just run all the way there, you don't need a vehicle. The burning hotel one I also got first go. In fact I think the only timed things I've failed are some of the supply drops and races, but could get them on a subsequent go once I knew the courses.

And yeah, fortunately those timed things are fairly short.

 ^ agree

It is the PC version that I attribute it to - they are way more difficult on the console for me; feels almost like I am playing in molasses with how sluggish the controller responds.

Another cool feature of the game is how you can commandeer a vehicle and friendlies will come along for the ride.  They will even take on the enemy - reminds me of a modded JC2.  :-X

The game continues to amaze, and please me  :-X

In this instance I was driving along the road in a regular vehicle when I came across a MGT.  Naturally I commandeered the truck and waited until a friendly got in as shotgun, and another took position in the gun turret.

My shotgun did not have too much to say
[smg id=5173 width=400 align=center]

... neither did the turret guy
[smg id=5174 width=400 align=center]

... but the Molotov chargers yelled quite a bit  :-()
[smg id=5175 width=400 align=center]

 :-D yeah, I tried to get a technical with four friendlies to help me with an outpost for fun but we happened upon a roadblock and they er, expired, before I got there.  :-()

I can't say that they are the most competent gunners  :-()

hehe, not really :) but they serve well as a bait: drive them at high speed towards enemies and jump out of the car while they.. keep the enemies busy smack in the middle of them  >:D

Good one!  :laugh:

i am really enjoying the bonus missions (the monkey ones with Hurk).  While one so far is linear, Medal of Honor style, some have been a pure pleasure.

Spoiler

Evidently Hurk is a barge captain and one of my missions is to rescue him from the Privateers.  I shot myself in the foot, not literally, but figuratively in this one - my task was to free Hurk from the bad guys, which I attempted from afar.  I killed all of the privateers from a great distance, but when I arrived to free Hurk, I could not do so because evidently I had to come close enough to initiate the mission.  My message was to kill all the privateers before freeing Hurk, but unfortunately they were already dead, and I could not finish the mission.

Sadness to report.  While the Hurk missions started out in the truest sense of open world nature as in FC2, I just encountered a run-and-gun mission in which there was an obnoxious timer top center.  To compound the problem, it was so dark, at any given time 90% of the screen was pitch black, and the little light provided was from the muzzle flashes of the privateers.  I even tried maximizing the brightness (there is no gamma control on the console) and that helped - now it was 90% washed out gray instead of black  :D 

Spoiler

I literally had to stumble around in the dark hoping to chance upon the correct path.  While the little yellow dot guided my path, when I approached, it disappeared, and if I did not find the correct opening in the darkness (which happend to be a pipe I had to swim through), the only recourse was to start over.

This seems to be a repeating pattern; start out with something that is so cool you think game of the year, and end up with something that is a bust.  Not for the entire game of course, but a huge disappointment in the developers yet once again.

I will try to commandeer one of the truck. I thought  the warriors didn't get in the truck with me if I commandeer it.

just don't drive, stay, wait, and they will get back into their old car. Apparently you cannot have others to hop in.

I waited but only the turret guy got back in the truck, the other guy refused to get in  ;D

Then I drove a little bit, got out the truck, got in. This time the turret gun didn't want to get in, so I hd to drive alone

 :laugh: not exactly reliable, those guys  :-()

I've been using a $10 set of headphones on my gaming PC ever since I bought the thing, and they are now well-worn with cracks in the headpiece so they practically fall off my head.

My sweetheart must have taken pity on me because she came home from Costco with Bose headphones.  "Try these" she says; of course I thanked her but didn't expect too much as I plugged them in and fired up FC3.

Boy was I wrong.  The sound is unbelievable, and is almost like being in a movie theater.  I never dreamed guns could boom like that using a pair of headphones.  ^-^

Nice :-X

I used to have a pair of studio-quality $300.00 Sennhauser headphones which sounded absolutely amazing for gaming - until the dog used them for a chew-toy. That's the closest she's come to being filleted >:(

I too have a rather expensive Sennheiser headset but keep using a Microsoft LifeChat LX-3000 for about 25.-€ which is lighter, softer, doesn't squeeze your head in and is of sufficient quality for voice chats which is the only purpose I need them for. The headset is set to be window's main communication device (voice in and out) while any other sound is routed through speakers. Like that, I can take the headset if and when I want to chat while the game sounds are always routed the same way. Of course, wearing a headset does muffle the game sound a bit but I can adjust either volume separately. I don't like all sound through earphones because someone yelling into my ears and competing with gun fire at the same volume level in my headset drives me crazy.  :-D

I'm now working my way through all the "Wanted" missions, and am really enjoying them as well, in true FC2 open world style.  My approach is similar in most - find a high spot and tag all the enemy with the camera, then from afar using the Z93 silenced, take out all the supporting guys.  Then it is time to sneak in the knife the intended targets.  Doing these is almost a mini-version of the outpost missions for me.  ^-^

There's a Wanted Dead mission in the south island where there are two leaders to take out, and both of them are flame-throwing privateer heavies, so make sure you have your Heavy Takedown Skill (whatever that's called) before you try it :-D I don't know what will happen if you try the mish without that skill, maybe it will still let you do it, I don't know. You should well and truly have that skill by then anyway.

Yes, I have all the skills available, so the heavy take-down was not difficult  :-()

I really enjoy the Wanted Missions. You said it all, PZ, they are mini versions of liberating outposts which is as open world as one can expect in this game. I love how we have the freedom to approach the missions. I too try to tag the enemies and then silently take them out one by one leaving just the main target to the end.

There are variations though. I had one mission (can't remember which) that placed the target and his body guards on the top of a hill so there were no high ground from where I could tag the guards. I had to go silently scouting the area and killing one by one with my Shredder and knife without knowing where the other guys were... thrilling!  8)

On another ocasion I approached the area and without dispatching any guard I runned towards the target and stabbed him straight away... I got the reward but had to kill all guards afterwards (good loot on the target by the way). I also had a great coincidence... As I was approaching the area where the target was, one jeep with Rakyats came from the other way and as soon as they saw the pirates a great shootout started. I shot a couple guards to give the Rakyat a good advantage and flanked the target, who was worried about the Rakyat and never saw me coming!  8)

On two occasions I managed to kill the target by jumping from the top of a rock on him... death from above!  >:D >:D >:D

I think I know the one you mean - some kind of bunker on a hilltop.  I too managed to sneak around taking out one after another until only the main target remained.  Man, the side missions are what keeps me in the game  :-X

I built some good cash doing those missions... you get between $175 and $300 for the target. If you loot him you get another $100 plus whatever loot you get from the guards and chests around you... doing five or six wanted missions can easily get you 2000+ and is loads of fun!  :-X

you can always hack at heavies several times to kill them but indeed, using that skill is more elegant.  :-D

I wish there is a setting that would allow those playing through a second time to have all the skills they developed before retained, and all weapons available.  Sure, my current mod allows that, but it would be nice if the developers would think more along the way that the gamers might think.  At least to have an options toggle for the things you want (or don't want)

Yeah I don't know why Ubisoft didn't do that ?
Some game allow gamers to start over with all the weapons, equipments, skils ... like Borderlands 2,  Arkham City, Demon's Souls ... but the enemies get considerably stronger, tougher.

Quote from: durian on January 02, 2013, 05:55:01 PM
Some game allow gamers to start over with all the weapons, equipments, skils ... like Borderlands 2,  Arkham City, Demon's Souls ... but the enemies get considerably stronger, tougher.

... or at least allow the player to replay certain portions.  They did this in the later AC games; once a mission is completed you can do it again as many times as you like.

When I look at the mod to make the outposts replay-able, it is amazingly simple.  It literally would have taken a programmer 30 seconds to add an options toggle for that function.

These were just kind of fun, and illustrates how I like to approach just about all the open world parts of the game.  Find a high spot, soften the area as much as possible, and then go in with stealth to finish off any stragglers.

[smg id=5268 width=400 align=center]

This was a "merc war" between the Rakyat and the pirates - these incidents really add to the game in a positive way
[smg id=5269 width=400 align=center]

 8) :-X

That first pic of the Wanted Dead mission is the one where I did my first Death From Above - off the top of that lean-to that the leader is lounging around under, after taking out his guards.

I like how if you come across a merc war and help out the Rakyat, they'll give you some money :-X Can come in handy in the early stages of the game, before the money starts to grow on the trees :-()

Dang, I forgot about helping out the Rakyat!

Here's a bit of flamethrower devastation.  I'm on South Island, and have not developed many skills yet so fighting the privateers can be quite the challenge
[smg id=5273 width=400 align=center]
[smg id=5274 width=400 align=center]
[smg id=5275 width=400 align=center]

I just did a hunting mission where I am to take out two bears with a machete.  Talk about frantic activity.  I was lucky that I got out of that scene without the bears taking MY hide.

 :-D That mission is a toughie. Perfect description - "frantic activity" :-()

Re: the flamethrower havoc - what a mess you made >:D

Gotta love that flamethrower!

depends on which side of the flamethrower you're acting  :-D

Roasting the baddies is so fun  :-X

I like to roast them with their own flammables.. shoot the Molotov chargers and you'll know what I mean  :-D

 :-()  :-X

Quote from: PZ on January 04, 2013, 09:59:45 PM
I just did a hunting mission where I am to take out two bears with a machete.  Talk about frantic activity.  I was lucky that I got out of that scene without the bears taking MY hide.

I found out that just like the pirates, they can't swim either. Get them to attack you at the river's edge and you can slash, then hopefully drown them...

Quote from: Jim di Griz on January 05, 2013, 02:58:10 PM
I found out that just like the pirates, they can't swim either. Get them to attack you at the river's edge and you can slash, then hopefully drown them...

That's a good one  :-X

Quote from: Art Blade on January 05, 2013, 01:35:08 PM
I like to roast them with their own flammables.. shoot the Molotov chargers and you'll know what I mean  :-D

I love it when the Molotovs torch on their bodies.  Another good one is to target the fuel tanks on the heavies that carry flamethrowers.

I was playing with the Z93 and shot at the tires of a Stryus - the tires burst off the wheels just like the Govmen trucks in JC2.  :-X

you can actually shoot out tyres of a moving car and watch it do a couple of nice somersaults and barrel rolls  :-D

Learn something new every day.  Man, this game is rich with features, all of which are better than the main story line.  :-X

I wholeheartedly agree with you  :-()

Just started my second play through on the console this morning, and I already have the plan how I'm going to w@&k my way through the island.  I must say that I'm enjoying FC3 even more than FC2 because of the variety of things to do and the diverse environment in which to travel.  I often find myself simply walking so I do not miss out on any of the fine details.  It is simply amazing how unique each area displays; continues to remind me of Panau in JC2.

Currently I have only completed the Dennis tutorial missions, and am receiving the message to go to the Docs place.  I've activated all the towers (10) so I can see the map, and and collecting items, doing lots of take-downs, and doing an occasional side mission.  I'm also creating as many of the pouches as I can.

As long as I keep away from the main story line, the game is simply fantastic, but I do appreciate the flexibility of the mods available for the PC version, which fits well into my gaming style.

 :-X

Quote from: Jim di Griz on January 05, 2013, 02:58:10 PM
I found out that just like the pirates, they can't swim either. Get them to attack you at the river's edge and you can slash, then hopefully drown them...

If I'm not mistaken, bears as well as tigers like water and can swim in real life.

As far as I know, all animals instinctively know how to swim. Only humans, and apes in general, need to be taught how. Even elephants can swim, using their trunks like snorkels. It's quite endearing to watch :-D

I did a few main story missions on the PC last night.  I think they were the "Buck" missions, and started out in rice fields where I am to escort the fool up to his place in the village.  This was one of my most hated missions on the PS3, so I tried the drug fields trick I used earlier.  The only problem is that there weren't any pirates in the village, but all the munitions and such were there, so that gave me an idea.  I set mines in places I knew enemy would be and then went down to the yellow circle to start the mission.

Although I did not see all my mines triggered, there was one on a deck to the upper right of the village as you face it that blew up with a massive explosion.  Either my mine was still there and still active, or he made a foolish mistake with his weapons.  :-()

In any case, playing on the PC was orders of magnitude easier using the mouse.  I can now say that it was even kind of fun doing this mission when in contrast the first time I went through on the console I almost threw the controller at the screen.  :-()

If you guys want to experience what I feel when using the PS3 controller, try fighting your next FC3 battle using your right foot to control the mouse.

The other parts of the Buck missions were interesting, but not too challenging using the mouse when going through the Chinese ruins.  As this was my second time through, I had more time to examine the environment, and it really strikes me that this area more than most are modeled after the experience in Uncharted2/3.  The "feel" going through was very much the same.

Quote from: PZ on January 07, 2013, 02:58:56 PMEither my mine was still there and still active, or he made a foolish mistake with his weapons.  :-()
[...]
on the console I almost threw the controller at the screen.  :-()

:laugh: &  :laugh:

I know what you mean PZ when you said you almost threw controller at TV  :laugh:

As many of you know, I love to play modded games.  I'm currently using the Schwarz mod v1.3 but i don't like how you have to pay large amounts of money for weapons that are made free by activating towers, so the solution I came up with was to use two mods.  First I went out to find a mod that made all weapons available from the beginning, then loaded my game and voila - weapons like the Z93 which were almost $7000 using Schwarz mod were now free as they were supposed to be.  I saved, then exited the game and then applied the Schwarz patches again.  When I reloaded the game, I still had the Z93 and other weapons I wanted, so I now get the best of all worlds (for my gaming style).

Evidently when you apply a patch, save your game, then apply another patch, at least some of what you had before will remain with you.

Excellent tip, PZ  :) +1 :-X

By the way, it works two ways. If you forgot your savegame was modded and you're using an unmodded patch, most or all of your mod stuff will be erased for good IF you save. And you'll have to start all over. And that mod enabled again, this time.

-- I know that kind of tragic accidents myself.  8-X :-D

Thanks AB  ^-^.

We at OWG do experiment quite a bit which results in a few discoveries.

Good point :)

I'd like to say that slightly differently.

"We at OWG do experiment quite a bit which results in a lot of discoveries.  :-D

 ^-^ :-X