As much as you love the game, are you almost finished in Africa, and looking for something new? You might check out some of the other open world games that members have been discussing. Here's an excellent post that summarizes the differences between FC2 and a next generation open world game, Just Cause2.
FC2 versus JC2 (http://openworldgames.org/owg/forums/index.php?topic=1628.0)
very kind of you, PZ :)
Thanks PZ!
I saw JC2 listed in this forum and was wondering if it's any good.
And, it IS. Hahahah.
Must try once I finish off FC2... :-X
I'll echo PZ's recommendation, mir24. Art wrote a good synopsis of their differences and similarities in that link.
Even without playing JC2 I can say it sure is the next step for open world games fans!
It`s o my list together with Assassins Creed 2 and Red Dead Redemption!
Funny... they are all 3rd person games 8)
Far Cry 2 is a completely different experience in which it aims for total immersion. Its goal is capture an atmosphere so that when you enter its world, you feel like you're walking through the dusty town of Pala, or sneaking into an enemy base in night. The creative developer explains what their goal was in this interview. (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/pax-08-far-cry-2/39274)
JC2 is a third-person action game that's main objective is to satisfy the player. It's ridiculous grapple hook feature that ignores gravity and laws of physics could keep one entertained for hours. Combined with a massive island to horse around on along with infinite possibility to blow things up, JC2 is really about stunts, and how crazy and insane they are. This video (http://www.gametrailers.com/video/freedom-interview-just-cause-2/62394) essentially details the goal of JC2.
I suppose what I'm getting at here is that FC2 and JC2 are two completely different experiences. I don't really compare them, it's more about what I'm interested in playing when I boot up my PC.
thats a good way to put it tophat. Often "similar" games are quite different in my mind and I appreciate those differences (otherwise every game would be the same).
I think a few small things that we all mentioned before JC2 came out could have made FC2 even better. Some civilian traffic and pedestrians, and some way to climb a little better are two that come to mind.
Both games have given me great gaming experiences without a doubt.
I played FC2 intensively (almost exclusively) for one year and I believe I know most of its aspects by now. I loved it :) JC2 for me is like moving on one step, leaving FC2's limits and going where JC2 has removed them. It is like the same basic idea but its world and freedom are just what I missed in FC2. Before playing JC2 I thought it might be the perfect continuation and having played it, I think it is :)
^That's probably my difference. I generally play FC2 in moderately portioned segments, and I'll often not play it for weeks, play something else, and then come back to it.
Quote from: Art Blade on June 14, 2010, 11:01:15 AM
... JC2 for me is like moving on one step, leaving FC2's limits and going where JC2 has removed them...
This is my sentiment exactly. TopHat01 is correct in that the two games are completely different in atmosphere, but similar in the ability of the gamer to experiment. Like Art, I too have played FC2 exclusively for nearly a year, and have come to realize the limitations as many of us have (weapons upgrades, lack of civilians, etc.) These limitations and many others have been largely solved in JC2.
While JC2 might not be everyone's cup of tea, it has proved to be a worthy successor to FC2 for me. Another one high on my list for experimentation value is RDR.
I agree with TopHat on that those games are different. That's why I stopped playing FC2 and went on playing JC2 ;D RDR however is out of my reach, being limited to a PC (or, not willing to switch to console).
Knowing Rockstar, I'm details about a PC version will start surfacing soon. Looking back at GTA:IV, it released in April of '08 for X360 and PS3, and then released on PC in November of '08. Hopefully RDR follows a similar pattern.
If so, you can count me in.. people here are all fascinated about it :)
I don't know about everyone else, but I just *wish* someone would come up with a sort of magic programming wand where I can select bits I like from one game, bits from another, and more bits from others, and put them all together to make a perfect game (well, perfect for ME)... Hahahah!
As much as game designers claim to make games for gamers etc. etc., I guess we all have different ideas of how a game should be like... There's just no pleasing everyone... ;)
Edit: "PLEASING", not "Pelasing"!
Too true, mir24. Just before I bought FC2 I read some absolutely scathing reviews online about it being boring and repetitive, but I got it anyway because I was such a fan of the original. Once I got into it, I couldn't fathom what all the naysayers had been on about. It's one of my favourite games ever.
As for RDR, I too would love to get into that as I've always liked the idea of an open world western-themed game. Hopefully there will be a PC version, and hopefully I'll have upgraded my clattering old jalopy of a computer in time for it ;D
A hardcore gamer at heart like you, fragger, will be more likely to upgrade his rig than waste his money on anything else ;D
That's right - who needs unnecessary luxuries like food, clothing, or running water? ;D
Need the electricity, though...
JC2 is already longing for better hardware than I've got, so I am tempted to buy at least a new vid card (cpu and all that should still be alright). But I'll hold back a little longer until, like you, I can't run a game at all any more. Then I will get a new rig, if I find a good prefab one :)
I echo the sentiment. My rig's only 3 years old and already I'm playing at Medium settings. I can only imagine playing FC2, FO3 and such at the highest resolutions! New graphics card very much in demand!
Ahhh bliss!
Fragger, you reminded me of that old Civ4 trailer:
Civ4 Addict: "There were times when I'd play the game for two, three days straight. Wouldn't get up to eat, wouldn't get up to go to the bathroom..."
Interviewer: "You didn't go to the bathroom for three days?"
Civ4 Addict: *pause* "I said I didn't get up ..."
LOL! ;D
Who needs food, clothing, or running water indeed!
(You can see the trailer here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Br1BWPWEdlQ)
Anyone can suggest a good graphics card for an AMD Athlon 2 4200?
I think it's not a good idea to upgrade that old a rig with a state-of-the-art vid card. Basically you'd want to buy what used to be state of the art when you got your PC three years ago, or a vid card that used to be cool say two years ago. Those should be cheap by now and probably not available any more (lol) - better get a new PC entirely if you can afford it.
Thanks for the advice! Yeah, most likely the latest graphics cards won't fit into my CPU. Sigh.
And to think I forked out a huge amount for my PC then. And now, I have to fork another bundle less than 3 years since...
This is madness!
What I'd do for a handful of diamonds now!
Although we've talked about it before, I thought I'd mention it because it seems appropriate now - don't forget the option of building your own - you can save a ton of diamonds.
Ah, I love Civ IV. :)
Quote from: mir24 on June 14, 2010, 06:24:11 PM
Fragger, you reminded me of that old Civ4 trailer:
Civ4 Addict: "There were times when I'd play the game for two, three days straight. Wouldn't get up to eat, wouldn't get up to go to the bathroom..."
Interviewer: "You didn't go to the bathroom for three days?"
Civ4 Addict: *pause* "I said I didn't get up ..."
LOL! ;D
ROLF! ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: wexer9 on June 15, 2010, 01:26:21 PM
Ah, I love Civ IV. :)
I think I mentoned it elsewhere, but there's a Civ V in the works.
Quote from: fragger on June 15, 2010, 06:55:49 PM
Quote from: mir24 on June 14, 2010, 06:24:11 PM
Fragger, you reminded me of that old Civ4 trailer:
Civ4 Addict: "There were times when I'd play the game for two, three days straight. Wouldn't get up to eat, wouldn't get up to go to the bathroom..."
Interviewer: "You didn't go to the bathroom for three days?"
Civ4 Addict: *pause* "I said I didn't get up ..."
LOL! ;D
ROLF! ;D ;D ;D
I ROFLMAO when I first watched that! Total classic!
Quote from: fragger on June 15, 2010, 06:55:49 PM
Quote from: wexer9 on June 15, 2010, 01:26:21 PM
Ah, I love Civ IV. :)
I think I mentoned it elsewhere, but there's a Civ V in the works.
There is, indeed. And this time, it's bye-bye squares and hello hexagons! :)
Quote from: Art Blade on June 14, 2010, 06:07:08 PM
JC2 is already longing for better hardware than I've got, so I am tempted to buy at least a new vid card (cpu and all that should still be alright). But I'll hold back a little longer until, like you, I can't run a game at all any more. Then I will get a new rig, if I find a good prefab one :)
That concerns me a bit Art, as I remember our systems are pretty much the same and I'd really thought I had bought a system that would run ahead of gaming requirements for at least a couple years. :P
I've looked at the JC2 vids and screen shots of Stalker COP and while they look like very good games I'm pretty much dug into FC2 for it's immersion qualities. I'm still playing FC2 20 to 30 hours a week and yes it's become predictable but then again comforting as a place I can slip away to and follow the script or take off and run a wild rampage.
I have two boxes full of games that I enjoyed on previous computers but have never been loaded onto my current rig though I may have to buy the last two Halflife2 episodes just to see how that series wraps up. The only thing that's kept me from doing that already is I hate having to re-buy all of the previous HL2 episodes that I already have in order to update, though the addition of Portal which is also bundled in the latest set has been intriguing (I see that JRD lists Portal as a currently playing).
I think instead of looking for a next generation game or improvements on existing games, I'm waiting for a quantum step to bump up my game play.
Is that a stick in the mud? No in's mandru in cammo upgrade waiting for just the right moment. ;D
Hehe :)
Computer game development these days leads to faster production (or buy) cycles than a couple of years ago. I remember times when a really good rid would last say three or four years, then it was like two or three years, now it's like two or one year until games become too demanding. I am talking about maxed-out game (graphic) settings. JC2 may be exceptional in this case as it is the only game I am aware of that refuses to w@&k with XP and requires dx10 (hence vista or win7).
Sometimes that kind of progression can be resolved with new drivers, sometimes with new hardware (back then, more RAM, now bigger GPU/vid ram). Today's and yesterday's CPUs should still be sufficient, but vid cards are the bottleneck I suspect.
I hear nVidia is currently working on a new driver (beta stage last time I checked) and a final version to be released in June this year, not far from now or perhaps already out now, which is supposed to increase JC2's performance.
The latest driver from Nvidia ver. 257.21 are now availible for download, and it´s WHQL certified. :) The changelog states that you´ll get 9 % increased performance in FC2 (2560x1600 8xAA/16xAF) and 25 % in JC2 (2560x1600 no AA/AF - Concrete Jungle) these numbers are ofcourse the maximum that you will get.
Very good, deadman :) :-X
http://www.nvidia.co.uk/content/DriverDownload-March2009/confirmation.php?url=/Windows/257.21/257.21_desktop_win7_winvista_32bit_international_whql.exe&lang=uk&type=GeForce
lol 125 MB vid driver download :D :)
I looked up the comparisons between our systems Art and it appears the the only difference is our graphics cards and some of the specialty controllers you've added.
Where you have the GTX260 mine is a GTX295 or basically two 260s with some additional memory unlocked. I could add one or two more of the 295s in SLI (whoa, an insane and expensive proposition) if I sacrificed the PCIe slot for my sound card which I've not really used since I built this system. My mother board does have a sufficient built in sound chip for watching videos.
I suspect that any future game developments that require the kind of muscle three 295s could provide would also require a complete rethink of any gaming system as we know it and at the same time render all of our systems outdated.
Maybe a game making full use of multi-threading, on a genuinely stable OS and based on one of the 48 (or higher) core CPUs that some of the tech sites like to speculate about is in all of our futures.
Hopefully I've built wise enough to stave those wolves off for a while.
Quote from: deadman on June 17, 2010, 10:50:54 AM
The latest driver from Nvidia ver. 257.21 are now availible for download, and it´s WHQL certified. :) The changelog states that you´ll get 9 % increased performance in FC2 (2560x1600 8xAA/16xAF) and 25 % in JC2 (2560x1600 no AA/AF - Concrete Jungle) these numbers are ofcourse the maximum that you will get.
Nice to know deadman but I'm afraid I'm a total loss at even beginning to know how to update a driver. In the past when I've tried to make those sort of updates I've had problems that have caused more harm than benefit.
Quote from: mandru on June 17, 2010, 11:07:19 AM
Quote from: deadman on June 17, 2010, 10:50:54 AM
The latest driver from Nvidia ver. 257.21 are now availible for download, and it´s WHQL certified. :) The changelog states that you´ll get 9 % increased performance in FC2 (2560x1600 8xAA/16xAF) and 25 % in JC2 (2560x1600 no AA/AF - Concrete Jungle) these numbers are ofcourse the maximum that you will get.
Nice to know deadman but I'm afraid I'm a total loss at even beginning to know how to update a driver. In the past when I've tried to make those sort of updates I've had problems that have caused more harm than benefit.
It´s not that hard mandru, this is how I do it:
1. I always start by using a program called "Driver cleaner pro" http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745 (http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745)
2. Tell the program to remove everything that comes from Nvidia (or ATI if you have those cards).
3. After a reboot I run the installer for the new drivers I have DL:ed and follow instructions on screen. Reboot when the installer tells you to and you´re done.
Thanks for the driver updates, guys. mandru, I'm running a GTX-295 in my rig, and when I did the last driver update, the process was seamless, and well worth the effort. My gaming significantly improved and made FC2 and JC2 run flawlessly. In fact, I mentioned in a prior post somewhere that the update made a huge difference in ArmA2, which has always been a process hog. I can run ArmA2 perfectly now.
The update itself was simple - download the file to your desktop, double-click it to start the installer, and when it's done, you're updated. It's basically just like installing any kind of software application.
Here's a link to the Vista, W7 64-bit nVidia drivers:
http://www.nvidia.com/content/DriverDownload-March2009/confirmation.php?url=/Windows/257.21/257.21_desktop_win7_winvista_64bit_english_whql.exe&lang=us&type=GeForce
mandru: I think our systems will be alright for some more time to come, and indeed my vid card is a little weaker (regarding shader units, mine is one of those with less, you're supposed to have the "better" one with more shader units in place per GTX260, two times in your case). Driver updates solve a lot over time until games really need more power ;)
deadman, nice.. I used to remove vid drivers too, but nowadays I just download the driver and hit install and let the system do the rest. Never had problems with that simple procedure. Apparently like PZ, I just hit install ;D
Quote from: mandru on June 17, 2010, 11:07:19 AM
I suspect that any future game developments that require the kind of muscle three 295s could provide would also require a complete rethink of any gaming system as we know it and at the same time render all of our systems outdated.
And can you imagine the heat that sucker would put out? I have a 280 or 290, forget exactly, and when running FC2 it's like sitting next to a space heater. Even on moderately warm days, or even not so warm, I have to run the A/C in my computer room just so the computer doesn't run up the room temperature too high.
I think that driver installations have come a long way since the days when you needed to download, unzip, enter into the control panel and seek out the proper driver. The install applications have not failed me yet. In fact, my worst example was when I lost power while doing a driver update - when I restarted my machine, all I did was double-click the file and it finished just fine.
Scary stuff guys. :(
I know where to find these links now, I'll have to think on it a while.
alright mandru.. we'll let you know when a new driver update is available. ;D
Thought I'd show this to you guys:
Quote from: Art Blade on June 17, 2010, 12:09:07 PM
Quote from: Art Blade on May 08, 2010, 12:31:12 PM
I decided to switch off SSAO, point light specular, Bokeh filter and GPU water simulation. The rest is on its max. Average fps 30.41, that I can live with, and everything looks still great :)
Having updated the nVidia driver 257.21 I now get 40.75 fps with these settings! whoa :-X
Cool - that's impressive results for a new driver. :-X
indeed it is. On a side note: Don't forget that there are always TWO ways of tuning vid results.
1) in game setup
2) vid driver setup
In my case I used the nVidia setup and uncompromisingly changed everything to "(high) performance" rather than high quality. Also, this time, I decided not to use "V-Sync" which may result in kind of sliced images sometimes (as if cut horizontally and slightly shifted upper and lower half of screen when changing directions rapidly) but overall it will improve performance.
That's a good tip - I know that I too sometimes forget to optimize the driver settings in the video card control panel within Windows.
Because I got so good results, for the fun of it I changed everything in game to max and it is still playable. Oh dear gods of game play, NOW this (JC2) looks so unbelievably great! :o :o :o :-X I just did a low fly in a fighter jet and cruised around over deserts, jungle, villages... OH sweet Jesus on a bicycle, I don't believe it! ARGH, I could eat the graphics, so crisp and sweet! Wowzers!
Quote from: Art Blade on June 17, 2010, 01:22:58 PM
OH sweet Jesus on a bicycle, I don't believe it! ARGH, I could eat the graphics, so crisp and sweet! Wowzers!
lol Art ;D I can feel the excitement!
hehehe ;D
Imagine, in the end (before that driver update) I had changed everything to low so I could get a decent framerate. I used to get those annoying slow-downs, like driving fast on an empty road, then oncoming traffic and the vid result was like instant hand brake or something like that, going slow without going slow, and then the game would speed up again. Now, in a fighter jet , I flew over villages and roads "lo-flyer record" type and no lag at all, and everything maxed out! in-f***ing-credible! :)
nice. I gotta get back to Panau. It'll feel great to get fast and vertical. After playing, and enjoying, RDR so much recently I think the first thing I'll do is fly a jet straight into the sky then bail and free fall within inches of my death - only to grapple the ground to safety ;)
very stylish, spaceboy ;D :-X
Impressive report - now I can't wait to do the latest update - have downloaded it but have not had the chance to do an installation yet.
Wow - this has been a hot topic today ;D
Thanks for the wealth of info everyone, especially the data on the new nvidia driver.
But I've already decided on my next gaming rig:
[smg id=2393 align=center width=380]
LOL Yeah, why check local stores.. check world's top 500 super computers and go for the top 10 of those ;D
By the way, US military use a super computer comprised of like 4,000+ PS3 ;D
Quote from: Art Blade on June 18, 2010, 08:05:35 AM
By the way, US military use a super computer comprised of like 4,000+ PS3 ;D
... to play what? Crysis? ARMA2? OFP2?
...
...
...
Pong? ;D ;D ;D
LOL :-X
hahaha! If only! ;D
Quote from: fragger on June 18, 2010, 06:26:09 AM
But I've already decided on my next gaming rig:
[smg id=2393 align=center width=380]
That's a nice set up but I was hoping for something a little more powerful than their laptop model. :P
I bit the bullet and updated the driver discussed earlier and it seems to have worked without a hitch.
well done, mandru :-X
Even if you screw up a new driver, you can still resort to VGA ("default/generic" windows driver) using cheap-looking graphics (like when you start windows in secure mode) and uninstall a new driver, and then install a previous version in case the new one didn't keep its promise. I did that once (and I still use an "old" nVidia driver on my XP setup) because the newer driver wasn't as good as a much older version regarding FC2 on that system.
Yeah, it's a lot better than it used to be when you had to manually switch to standard VGA first, reboot, install new driver (maybe uninstall the old driver first, depending), reboot, then switch to the new driver once you were back up. Those were fun times.
Hehehe, there were even funnier times. Remember those times when games needed VESA drivers and you needed to free conventional memory using a config.sys and autoexec.bat and commands like "loadhigh" for the mouse driver and some such crap? :)
Good job mandru :-X I don't think you will regret it - I also did the update this afternoon - was using 197.xx and am now updated to the latest 251.xx. I tried all of my games, and did not really notice as much of a change as I did when changing from the driver prior to 197.xx to 197.xx, but I can run all of my games at ultra high.
@Art and D_B - yeah I recall those days with a shudder. I recall my first PC - was the original IBM (before the "clone" time). The machine had a 4.77 mhz cpu, 640k RAM (not a typo for you youngsters), and no hard disk. How much did one of those bad boys cost, you say? I got a steal of a deal because I purchased two at the same time - they only cost me $2,250.00 each. :'(
My first office office software was bare bones - one was PFS Write (a word processor little better than a typewriter), and a database created by Borland called Reflex. Both of these programs would fit on a single 360k 5.25-inch floppy.
Of course, you had to write your own autoexec.bat to load the programs to your liking. My routine to start the day was to pop in the first of two 5.25-inch floppy discs, which contained an autoexec.bat. Part of the batch file created a RAM disk in a portion of the 640k, and then DOS instructions to copy the word processor and database program files into the RAMdisk. Finally, the batch file contained the instructions to start a simple DOS-based menu. From this menu, I could run either the word processor or the database in 256k of the base RAM from the roughly 360k RAMdisk. I thought this was really cool at the time because everything was based entirely in the 640k of base memory, and the user files on the data floppy in the 5.25-inch drive. Then when the day was over, saving the files one more time, flip the switch off and everything in RAM evaporated.
Imagine a word processor and database both loaded into RAM, and only 256k of RAM dedicated to running these programs. Today a single temp file (of the hundreds in your temp directory) can be way larger than that.
Talk about simple days - Windows was not yet a sparkle in Bill Gates eyes, and most people didn't even know what a computer was.
Very nostalgic, PZ :) Man, I'm glad those days are over. I had got just enough of them ;D
After reading through this thread I went upstairs and gave the x360 a little love ;D
;D
Quote from: KingRat on June 19, 2010, 02:36:54 PM
After reading through this thread I went upstairs and gave the x360 a little love ;D
Better watch it, I think that's illegal in Tennessee......
ROFL! :-X
hahaha! ;D
My nVidia driver is dated January 2010, and it runs FO3 and FC2 really quite well at moderate to high settings, so i think i'll leave well enuf alone. TBH, i dont know if there's much point in updating my rig much anymore. Its 2 years old running XP, with a 9800 GTx 512mg, so it's almost an antique now. :-[
BTW what was the OT again?? ;)
you're starting to confuse me with those abbreviations. TBH and BTW are known to me, alright, but OT? "Off Topic?" or "Occupational Therapy"?
Maybe this: "In cryptography, an oblivious transfer protocol (often abbreviated OT) is a protocol by which a sender sends some information to the receiver, but remains oblivious as to what is received." ;D
Geez... its On Topic / Off Topic...
Sry for the confusion. I was thinking OT= Original topic, which sort of vanished a few pages ago. ;D
Speaking to the topic, what ever happened to FC3 anyway? I've heard nothing since right after FC2 was released. :-\ It would be a crying shame if the sequel potential for this ground breaking game is never realized.
I haven't read a thing about it, but you're absolutely correct - the game sure would have a dedicated following if it was anything like FC2.
Maybe the devs saw what had been achieved with the JC2 world and went back to the drawing board.
I agree that it would be a real shame if there was never any worthy successor to FC2. If it was done well, I certainly know a bunch of people that would snap it up ;)
Hehe, I was just visualising a meeting of the FC3 crew:
- Alright guys, we're almost finished! We'll collect awards! We'll be rich!
- Yeah, this game is cool, it will blow them away!
Door opens, another dev with very pale face and cold sweat on his forehead enters
- Erm, guys.. I nicked this off my son, watched him play it.. they call it JustCause2
Starts PC and fires up JC2, shows them some stuff
- Oh f@#k!
- Alright, guys. If we want to keep our jobs, we better start from scratch!
- Man, they're only on their first sequel! We're on our second, and it looks like pong by comparison!
;D
LOL Art ;D ;D ;D
I was just thinking... the dev team for Duke Nukem Forever must have had that same conversation many, many times. I wonder if they're still working on it...
DNF.. we've got a topic about that game here (http://openworldgames.org/owg/forums/index.php?topic=603.msg7092#msg7092) -- haven't checked in a while, but I think the last thing I heard was that they gave up due to bankruptcy.
Quote from: Art Blade on June 22, 2010, 05:27:10 PM
DNF.. we've got a topic about that game here (http://openworldgames.org/owg/forums/index.php?topic=603.msg7092#msg7092) -- haven't checked in a while, but I think the last thing I heard was that they gave up due to bankruptcy.
There was a conflict between the devloper and the publisher regarding the ownership of the rights to the game because of the looong time they spent developing it. And there was ofcourse the enormous internet rumour that surfaced just before the E3 that Valve would announce that
they were going to convert it to the Source engine and release it on Steam. None of witch turned out to be true naturally ;)